Curse

bhavv · Mar 25, 2008, 03:58 AM // 03:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta_yoda

and to above, rits suck cause they cant prot , ud get pounded by a hammer warrior before u can even cast a spell

No, you try using 2 rit henchmen in cantha on HM instead of the lousy monks then say that XD.

You can make 2 rit healers and put a couple of aegis and prot spirits on your necros or ellys.

I vanquish any area of cantha where 2 rit hench are available without a single fail monk XD.

Necros with prots, wards on me and rit healers with attuned was songkai FTW.

masta_yoda · Mar 25, 2008, 04:06 AM // 04:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

No, you try using 2 rit henchmen in cantha on HM instead of the lousy monks then say that XD.

You can make 2 rit healers and put a couple of aegis and prot spirits on your necros or ellys.

I vanquish any area of cantha where 2 rit hench are available without a single fail monk XD.

Necros with prots, wards on me and rit healers with attuned was songkai FTW.

i was referring to pvp

bhavv · Mar 25, 2008, 04:11 AM // 04:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta_yoda

i was referring to pvp

Rit spike and spirit way?

PVP was the first place where monkless teams emerged are were godly IMBA. So why cant monks do the same thing?

Tamuril elansar · Mar 25, 2008, 10:29 AM // 10:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

You're not seriously suggesting that Blood is Power, Offering of Blood, or Spoil Victor, are bad, are you?

That's two. Then there's Putrid Explosion, Putrid Bile, and Well of the Profane. A bunch more are good, but not outstanding - however you do realize that the point of Death Magic is minions, and that minionmasters have the greatest damage-per-second of anyone in the game, right?

That argument works equally well for every single non-instant AoE spell in the entire game. Meteor shower sucks. Maelstrom sucks. Savannah Heat sucks. Chaos Storm su... No wait, that one really DOES suck.

meteor shower does suck, you can easily move out of it or interupt it
mealstrom is only good if you can get some1 in it snared, and even than you're just waisting the energy cuz you can also get a mesmer to disable a monk.

putrid explosion recuires a corpse, so its not really good as its barely usable in a match, putrid bile i already mentioned is pretty good if you can cover it and get advantage out of it at a good time, well of profane is not good, also on of those things you just move out of and never walk into + you first need to kill stuf

blood is power is just lol, learn to maintain energy and get a good elite.
offering of blood...necro's don't need energy mana, if they do you have sig of lost souls, their much better elites instead
spoil victor can also be replaced by better necro elites like corupt enchant or taint, both will give more presure and makes things die faster.

edit: i was reffering to pvp. nvm if you think pve needs balance

upier · Mar 25, 2008, 11:04 AM // 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

Pretty sure Inspiration is already good.
Smiting and (maybe) Blood are the only two that might need to be buffed. You have to realize that most of these trees were not made for you to spec 14 (or 16 if you're suicidal) into - rather, things like Inspiration, Shadow & Deadly, and Command were meant to be "splashed" for - speccing 6-9 into, rather than placing heavy atts in the tree.

The e-management of Inspiration isn't THAT good. And considering this is supposed to be the e-management the mesmer has - that's a bit of an issue.
The problem is what else the line offers.
So it's difficult to buff that because it would blow up otherwise.

Smitting is an issue because of the support capabilities that the other 3 lines offer. Considering how insane they are - smitting once again needs to pretty bad.

Command - isn't something that one would invest 6-9 in. The problem is that if one invests less then 9 into it - one needs to bring up motivation to at least 9 for the shield.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malice Black

Blood. It sucks, badly.

There is no way they can buff that.
Life stealing needs to be kept in check. IF the life stealing would be changed into shadow damage - we'd have something to work with.

Stormlord Alex · Mar 25, 2008, 11:17 AM // 11:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

Resilience of the bear - you gain 1...10 health regen lasts 8 secs, recharges in 12.When it ends, you lose all hexes and conditions and gain 100...250 health

Fix'd

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

There is no way they can buff that.
Life stealing needs to be kept in check. IF the life stealing would be changed into shadow damage - we'd have something to work with.

Blood needs a total overhaul - given the nature of life-stealing and armour-ignoring damage in general, if blood gets to be anywhere near a viable damage line, bloodspike will rear its ugly head again.

More support stuff like Orders and BR and more degen- and hex-based damage (so it can't stack) is the way forward, imo.

odly · Mar 25, 2008, 11:54 AM // 11:54

Some of these skill lines are fine the way they are. You have to accept they have their own play styles though.

Just and example :

A Blood necro can be good in PvP for spiking and he can be good in PvE for an orders necro supporting a physical team. He indirectly deals more damage than each off the phisicals on their own.

Not that this is the only thing a blood necro can do btw.

N1ghtstalker · Mar 25, 2008, 12:07 PM // 12:07

blood magic has great skills but those are mostly only usable in PvE (spoil victor ftw) nonetheless a buff would be really nice
and the guy who says Blood is power and Spoil victor are bad doesn't know what great use those skills have in PvE

ManMadeGod · Mar 27, 2008, 10:26 AM // 10:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

There is no way they can buff that.
Life stealing needs to be kept in check. IF the life stealing would be changed into shadow damage - we'd have something to work with.

Make it non-stackable skill, make it a hex.
hex spell(...sec) steal 20...40 health from target foe, and that foe is hexed with xxxxxx, loses ..... heath each second.

Problem solved.
Something like how they fix Rit spike (Spirit Burn and Ancestor's Rage).

Or something special:
Elite hex spell: for ... seconds, whenever target foe uses a skill, that foe sacrifices 2...15% health. (maximum 60... 100).

zwei2stein · Mar 27, 2008, 10:51 AM // 10:51

Blood is pretty awesome, imho:

D/N Orders, gogogo.

It could use some love as DD line, true, but it is support line never intended to be 12+X specced, and in that it is okay and viable.

If you want:

Vamp Gaze: Steal 10...100 HP from foe, target foe cannot be affected by lifestealing for 1 second.

Its one seccond of immunity that would render spike builds with LS useless.

silara_jorinset · Mar 27, 2008, 01:10 PM // 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esan

If Earth Magic is terrible, why are 99% of ele tanking builds built around Stone Striker/Stoneflesh Aura/Armor of Earth/Sliver Armor/Obsidian Flesh?

Grasping Earth and Ward Against Melee would, by themselves, redeem the attribute in PvP. In fact, I see only one absolutely useless skill in that attribute: Iron Mist.

What other line would eles use to tank otherwise? Pure tanks are pretty lame irrepective of pve/pvp anyway. Aside from some of the aoe spells (Sandstorm, eruption), the line is quite weak offensively. Off course it shouldn't be as powerful as lines such as fire but some of the spells need a buff. Earth should really be about knockdowns and conditions imo and better synergies such as ebon hawk/stoning. I remember a very decent post on guru a while back talking about improvements to the earth line (from a balanced pvp/pve viewpoint).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

Smiting for monks. Here's the deal: monks are not damage dealers. They're the games best tanks and the games best healers, but if you want to do serious damage to stuff... oh wait, monks can do that too. In fact, I seem to remember doing Cathedral of Flames and parts of the UW in hardmode with just two monks in last week, and wasn't I farming raptors and angorodons with those monks too? Yeah, I believe I was. What was the question again?

Whoopdido. I don't get your point, you saying other classes can't farm or something? It doesn't stop smiting prayers being very weak compared to other classes offensive lines (I bet the E/A, A/E eles were able to farm the raptors faster than your monk). Considering Cathedral of flames is mostly undead, of course you can do damage there but sadly all smiting prayers is relegated to at the moment is killing undead in pve.

Esan · Mar 27, 2008, 01:29 PM // 13:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by silara_jorinset

Earth should really be about knockdowns and conditions imo and better synergies such as ebon hawk/stoning.

Well, it is an opinion that I don't share. Why should a defensive line be deemed useless if it has no offense?

Stormlord Alex · Mar 27, 2008, 01:56 PM // 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by silara_jorinset

but sadly all smiting prayers is relegated to at the moment is killing undead in pve.

Smiters buff physicals rather than deal direct damage. Not every offensive attribute has to nuke stuff like Fire Magic to be a viable offensive line.

It just so happens Smiting is a bunch of hybrid offensive support stuffs rather than a direct damage line, which is fine.

Tyla · Mar 27, 2008, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

Rit spike and spirit way?

PVP was the first place where monkless teams emerged are were godly IMBA. So why cant monks do the same thing?

But Weapon of Warding and Weapon of Shadow still have quite sexy effects, and unstrippability is good.
But a full team based on it is stupid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by masta_yoda

and to above, rits suck cause they cant prot , ud get pounded by a hammer warrior before u can even cast a spell

[skill]splinter weapon[/skill][skill]ancestors' rage[/skill] Are the powerhouses.
[skill]weapon of warding[/skill][skill]weapon of shadow[/skill] Act as prots.
Unremovable buffs = win.
But using a full team with protting based around only weapon spells is /fail.

P.S -- Rits are more of what Smite/Heal Monks should be.

Quote:

and generally monks are made for stopping red bars going down and filling them up when they need filling up thats what monks do, smiter monks suck these days

Fix'd.

Axagoth Baal · Mar 28, 2008, 12:08 AM // 00:08

I agree when u say smiting monks have a supporter role while dealing damage, but some skills are simply terrible and do need to be changed.
Banish, Smite, Scourge Sacrifice, Defender's Zeal and Word of Censure are some of them...

Stormlord Alex · Mar 28, 2008, 12:13 AM // 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axagoth Baal

I agree when u say smiting monks have a supporter role while dealing damage, but some skills are simply terrible and do need to be changed.

http://gwshack.us/60086

http://gwshack.us/bb6f4

Defender's Zeal is actually pretty insane in HM. Imagine Zealot's Fire + Divine Boon and being able to spam spells with both on you.

Scourge Sacrifice is simply too niche as a counter, it'd suck regardless of what attribute it was in.

Everything else is direct damage, which is better off dead tbh. Unless you want teams of 8 monks being invincible and spiking people down with Smites.

I'm not a fan of buffing things simply because they suck.

Axagoth Baal · Mar 28, 2008, 12:48 AM // 00:48

Changing numbers like damage or recharge time is not the only way to buff skills, they could also change skills in how they work. DZ + zealot's fire is fine as long as u use in pve, but eles are still better . I'd just like to see some of those skills that nobody uses be more useful, talking abt pvp

Splitisoda · Mar 28, 2008, 01:17 AM // 01:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yuhe Ji

The reduction is only for ranger or touch skills, and those ranger skills can take quite a bit of energy. Anyways...
I think Deadly Arts needs a buff. Doesn't have much use in common sin builds. Necros don't need any more buffs.

Ranger for touch skills? Last I checked R/A MB/DB goes longer then an assassin can do it, and you dont have to worry about spamming critical strike. It works on ALL attack skills, and ALL ranger skills.